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Hidro | | 06/03/11 10:34 pm - Last edited 06/03/11 11:26 pm by Hidro | Filter |
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| Okay, so pretty soon we are going to reorganize the Pokedex, rebalance base stats, and stuff like that. We can't see around ALL the corners, so I thought I'd get the community opinion on Pokemon typing. We want the game to be balanced and interesting, so that means we might be pushing around types. This topic is for the discussion of advantages/disadvantages to existing Pokemon Twilight type combos. This is just to get the ideas flowing, and we probably won't make drastic changes. But a little discussion now could make for a much more interesting competitive battling scene in the future.
I've been thinking, for example, that Ohdax should be changed from Light/Ground to Normal/Ground or just Ground. The change would increase game balance and add variety because we already have Anizole with a Ground/Light typing.
We don't have much many light types either, so I think it could be fun to transfer the light typing over to Sagerush and make it a Light/Poison. |
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David | |
Pyco Artist
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| I don't think Dragon/Fire for Infernox is a good typing. Dragon just seems too OP for a starter pokemon, just like a free reshiram at the beginning of the game. If it wasn't a starter, then dragon/fire would be epic, but yeah just my opinion on that.
Oh and what are the weaknesses and strengths of Light type again?
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Bouncy Ball | |
Champion
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| light is strong against:
dark, ghost, and psychic
it does 1/2 damage against:
steel, rock, and ground
psychic, ghost do 1/2 to it
dark is super effective vs light
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Coronation | | 06/04/11 03:10 am - Last edited 06/04/11 03:14 am by Coronation | Filter - Reply #3 |
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| Since when was Ohdax Ground/Light? I always thought it was just pure Light O_o If that's true though, then I agree that it shouldn't be Ground/Light, and that either Normal or Light/Fighting would be a better choice, preferably the latter.
But the main issue I have when it comes to balance is how bad Starlit/Reagle are. For a starting bird, they have pretty low defenses and Attack isn't too good either, although it has alright Speed. It doesn't learn many good moves, and as of now, it's registered as a pure Flying type. I know that it was gonna be fixed in the next version, but I was just bringing that up. It's hard to use Starlit because it can't really beat stuff easily and it is too easily knocked out, and that it evolves in the mid 20s. Reagle sufers through the same problem that Starlit does, although it has more HP to sponge an attack or two. However, it really doesn't learn much, and that causes serious problems. I think Reagle needs a boosted Attack stat and a better movepool, and it will be fine.
Another issue is that Lileef should be more common in the early routes. Having it set as morning only makes it hader for players to defeat the first gym leader, especially if they pick Singet. I don't see a reason why Lileef couldn't be found in the day.
Warmy is almost impossible to use, evolving super-late, having weak stats, and a near non-existant movepool bar Bug Bite and Rollout until it learns Earthquake as a Worgeddon in its late 30s. I think Warmy should just be moved somewhere else, although I do remember someone talking about that before as I type this.
Proti should regain its Normal/Psychic typing (I know this is being done, but just another reminder). It's really weak without proper STAB.
Jurker is kinda weak too, but I'm not too sure what should be done to it. Maybe more defense or something? Not really sure. Maybe balancing some other things will help it out a bit.
Cubbear needs to learn more moves XD
And Myraid/Hybrian should be distinct from Vatick/Oculet, because they share similar stats, but Oculet's are a bit better. Maybe when it evolves into Boolian, it should gain more Sp.D.
Oh, and Welion needs a small boost or something, because I don't think going through Dandaloft training is worth it. It really doesn't have anything when it evolves, and it has really bad defenses. In addition, the Special Attack is actually just above average, and that stat is where its STAB comes from.
That's all of the problems I can think of by looking at the Dex. Maybe I'll play through Twilight again so I can examine it more closely.
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KaBob799 | |
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| Yeah warmy is already moved in the current gmk.
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Kaiser Cat | |
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| Ohdax should be Light/Ground just because of the lack of ground types.
And I still think Light should be weak to poison. |
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Iasper | |
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| Let's see...
Fire/Dragon Infernox is fine, but keep its base stats normal. Don't give it pseudo-legendary stats, try to make an amount of total base stats and distribute it across all final starter evolutions to make them equal in strength. And give the other starters awesome moves like Infernox knows Crazy Flame, Dragon Dance, etc.
Like Coronation said, there is no special reason that causes Lileef to only appear in the morning. It only makes the game harder than it already is.
Normal/Flying would be more logical for Starlit and Reagle instead of Flying/Normal.
Welion should indeed be stronger. It's hard to get it at this point and its stat just aren't worth it. Because it's based on a lion, a pretty high attack stat would be logical.
A bit off-topic, but how is determined in which evolution Trilotoggle evolves?
A Normal/Psychic typing isn't really good for Mesmablob. The normal type neutralises the fighting-type attacks. Also, Mesmablob doesn't seem really 'normal'. More like Psychic/Ghost or something.
Mechasnap, pure Steel? A Steel/Dark or Steel/Fighting would fit it better. And with a bigger move pool and a good Attack base stat, I'm sure Mechasnap can be a monster in online battling.
Jurker is indeed pretty weak. Its base stats should be improved a little.
Fire/Poison would be more logical for the Scrug line than Poison/Fire.
The Myraid line is too weak to be that rare. Their stats should be alot higher, if you know Oculet's really common and their stats are higher than Myraid. I'm not saying that it should become less rare, just boost its base stats alot.
I have no idea why Rotato is Bug/Steel and Pillage is Steel/Bug. That just doesn't make sense.
Ohdax should be Light/Ground, yeah.
Junzu's stats also needs to be improved, and they need to be improved alot if it is getting a pre-evo.
That's everything, I think. I might add things later.
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Dark Matter | |
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| Just concerning the Fire/Dragon typing, I think this was probably why Charizard was made Fire/Flying. But when you think about it, Infernox is just so cool he deserves to be Dragon - who cares about him being OP? He's the best starter :P
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David | |
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| dragon's still kinda unfair for a starter even if the base stats aren't as high as pseudo's. The type's just too all rounded.
@TwilightDusk, about Myraid. Can't it be found in route 1? Nothing found early game should be THAT strong imo. Also, Junzu's getting a pre-evo!? epic! be a little fighting guy, like tyrogue just cuter. |
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Iasper | |
Group: Member
| QUOTE: David dragon's still kinda unfair for a starter even if the base stats aren't as high as pseudo's. The type's just too all rounded.
@TwilightDusk, about Myraid. Can't it be found in route 1? Nothing found early game should be THAT strong imo. Also, Junzu's getting a pre-evo!? epic! be a little fighting guy, like tyrogue just cuter.
Yes, it can be found there. But at a very, very low chance, and even then only at night. I reached my 18 hours playtime and I only found one. |
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David | |
Group: Member
| Just the presence of that little chance makes it unnecessary for a stat boost imo. |
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 Lody | | 06/04/11 12:05 pm - Last edited 06/04/11 12:05 pm by Lody | Filter - Reply #11 |
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| QUOTE: David dragon's still kinda unfair for a starter even if the base stats aren't as high as pseudo's. The type's just too all rounded.
maybe they could even it out if they made infernox susceptible to ice attacks (seeing as he's fire-type it could go either way)
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Hidro | |
Group: Admin
| We could make light good against dragon to help balance it out. |
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Coronation | | 06/04/11 06:21 pm - Last edited 06/04/11 06:46 pm by Coronation | Filter - Reply #13 |
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| QUOTE: TwilightDusk Let's see...
Fire/Dragon Infernox is fine, but keep its base stats normal. Don't give it pseudo-legendary stats, try to make an amount of total base stats and distribute it across all final starter evolutions to make them equal in strength. And give the other starters awesome moves like Infernox knows Crazy Flame, Dragon Dance, etc.
Like Coronation said, there is no special reason that causes Lileef to only appear in the morning. It only makes the game harder than it already is.
Normal/Flying would be more logical for Starlit and Reagle instead of Flying/Normal.
Welion should indeed be stronger. It's hard to get it at this point and its stat just aren't worth it. Because it's based on a lion, a pretty high attack stat would be logical.
A bit off-topic, but how is determined in which evolution Trilotoggle evolves?
A Normal/Psychic typing isn't really good for Mesmablob. The normal type neutralises the fighting-type attacks. Also, Mesmablob doesn't seem really 'normal'. More like Psychic/Ghost or something.
Mechasnap, pure Steel? A Steel/Dark or Steel/Fighting would fit it better. And with a bigger move pool and a good Attack base stat, I'm sure Mechasnap can be a monster in online battling.
Jurker is indeed pretty weak. Its base stats should be improved a little.
Fire/Poison would be more logical for the Scrug line than Poison/Fire.
The Myraid line is too weak to be that rare. Their stats should be alot higher, if you know Oculet's really common and their stats are higher than Myraid. I'm not saying that it should become less rare, just boost its base stats alot.
I have no idea why Rotato is Bug/Steel and Pillage is Steel/Bug. That just doesn't make sense.
Ohdax should be Light/Ground, yeah.
Junzu's stats also needs to be improved, and they need to be improved alot if it is getting a pre-evo.
That's everything, I think. I might add things later.
I'm pretty sure all of the starters have the same base stats. It's just that Infernox has the best typing. I'm not really sure what to do with it. If Spiquil was able to get Earthquake, it would be able to defeat Infernox (Infernox shouldn't be able to learn any Ground moves besides Dig.) Infernox could just be weaker than the other two starters by a little bit, like they did with Gen 4, when Torterra had the highest base stats out of the three. It wouldn't make a big difference though. EDIT: As for Light helping ot balance it out, I can see Light resisting Dragon as a way to keep Infernox balanced. I always thought that the Light type was being underutilized, with its main purpose being a ghost killer. Having it balance out Dragons would be another great purpose for it, and it would be a pretty good way to keep Dragons in check.
Trilotoggle is supposed to evolve depending on where it is when it hits Lv. 40. It would evolve into Petraflow if it evolves while surfing, and Fossfian if it evolves on land. However, this doesn't work, and it only evolves into Petraflow as of now.
Another idea is to make Mesmablob Poison/Psychic since it is a virus. It'd probably be better than Normal/Psychic anyway.
I think Mechasnap already has a good attack stat, but I do need to check because I haven't evolved my Lolzie yet. It definately needs a better movepool though, and I think Mechasnap could possibly be Steel/Dark, as it does fit it.
I think that Myraid and Hybrian don't really need stat boosts - I just think Boolian should be strong in other areas to stand out from Voyant. With both being pure Psychic and exceling in the same areas (although Oculet is stronger than Hybrian to a degree), it doesn't really look good. However, as David said, with the ability to catch Myraid early, it doesn't really need to be strong. However, since Hybrian evolves with an item instead of level, Boolian can get a stat jump in areas that will make it different from Voyant without worring about making it OP for the early game, since it won't evolve for a while. Basically, the first two forms can be early game friendly, while the final form gets a jump. Making it more defensive than Voyant with a focus on Special Defense sounds good to me.
And why does Ohdax need to be Light/Ground? It doesn't even look like a Ground type at all, and I think it's more suited to be a Fighting type. I wouldn't mind seeing it as a Fighting/Ground or Light/Fighting, but it shouldn't share the same typing as Anizole, as it is more fitting for the role. Although I do have to ask this - what exactly is Ohdax supposed to be anyway? |
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Hidro | |
Group: Admin
| Haha, Ohdax is a giant ground sloth. That's why it would have the ground typing. |
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Coronation | | 06/04/11 07:03 pm - Last edited 06/04/11 07:27 pm by Coronation | Filter - Reply #15 |
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| Oh, I guess that's why everybody is so content on the Ground typing. I could see Ohdax as just Ground, although I don't really get its hands anymore. I always thought that they were like blades that it used to use Light attacks. Do you know why they're like that?
EDIT: Multipede could also be changed from Bug to Bug/Light. It's just a thought, but it always did give off that vibe to me. |
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Hidro | |
Group: Admin
| QUOTE: Coronation Oh, I guess that's why everybody is so content on the Ground typing. I could see Ohdax as just Ground, although I don't really get its hands anymore. I always thought that they were like blades that it used to use Light attacks. Do you know why they're like that?
EDIT: Multipede could change from Bug tpp Light/Bug/ Just a thought.
When I designed it in 5th grade I thought they looked like sloth claws =P. I was always very fond of it so I didn't change the design. But they are rather like blades and I always thought of it as a light type. I just don't know why. It doesn't really make much sense when I think about it. |
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Coronation | |
Group: Member
| I still like the design though, and I don't think it should change much. Ohdax is pretty cute anyway  |
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Lody | |
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| QUOTE: Hidro Haha, Ohdax is a giant ground sloth. That's why it would have the ground typing.
that's what it was!?
I always wondered what the hell it was!
but to be honest I hate Ohdax... |
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Dusk209 | |
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| Making Infernox a Dragon/Fire type would to be easily fixable by lowering his defenses a bit to keep him in line with the other starters.
Also, is there a page with all of the Pokemon's current base stats? |
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PT Typing
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